Conversations

ago @ Astelliard

This may be among the most realistic ways to move planets with small initial amounts of energy. Just have to map the trajectories of small bodies across the solar system.

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ Reincarnation of Fashion Waste: Wearable Bacterial Art

My next step is to experiment. So I'm in the step of searching materials (second-hand clothes). I realised that:

  • Canvas is the most important in each art piece making. This core item has to be good quality to reflect the idea of wearable art for the future, so it has to be "wearable" and durable in quality. Also an item has to have plenty of space for making (like a blank sheet of paper), one colour is best.

  • Each finished art piece would need to communicate the message that each reincarnated bunch of clothes is a system. Here, I have a question: What are the essential patterns of systems? These patterns would be expressed in each art piece. E.g. Metabolism, Whole is More than Parts (contrast as a feature of each art piece). Based on how this question is answered, ideas will appear and help me to select second-hand clothes for making the elements that will inhabit the canvas.

  • In general, systemic thinking and systems education will be embeded into this practice of wearable bacterial art. Everyone who is a W.BARTIE, will need to collaborate with a local organisation who has microscopes, and this way to embody the idea of systems thinking (science-art partnerships in this case) where an interaction between different elements produce the whole that's more than its parts.

  • Wearable Bacterial Art is a cleansing ritualistic art form where the process is often more importan than the final result. As an art practice it is used to transform fashion waste and emotional waste into value.

to be continued...

[reply]

Ruta

ago @ Reincarnation of Fashion Waste: Wearable Bacterial Art

Interesting - I was thinking about Wearable Art before I got to know from a friend Serena that there is a World of Wearable Art competition! Seems like a cool community to connect. :)

[reply]

Ruta

ago @ Mine life for molecules to treat bacteria

So, like, mice and rats that live in sewerage pipes -- they must have evolved something to survive. A research into their immune system adaptations might be helpful.

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ Octahoop

The Octopus also symbolises a mycelium network for me. When walking, the human body touches the earth (the network): the interaction between two systems. The interaction always sparks something.

[reply]

Ruta

ago @ Shift in Human Values from Input to Output

"Producerism is an ideology which holds that those members of society engaged in the production of tangible wealth are of greater benefit to society than, for example, aristocrats who inherit their wealth and status." ~ Wikipedia

I wonder, what word would reflect a sense of "output" as a natural expression of self, also a balance between "input" (experiences) and "output" (creating) and sound more reserved, being about inner journey? Producing is not about status as wikipedia suggests, but something deeper, happiness for self and not showing off for others.

[reply]

Ruta

ago @ SYMBÉS

Symbés are back! Our symbiotic art will be at SDGs showcase with Doingud soon! Learning about NFTs too, lol. Stay tuned.

((And it seems that SYMBÉS are in fact capturing its identity as a symbiotic immersive art collective, other things will probably stay in our other projects such as Instinto Creador and KOKONO.))

[reply]

Ruta

ago @ Octahoop

How beyond symbolism could this hairhoop capture creative energy that lands from the Universe?

Well, I want to discover that too :) First thoughts that came to mind where: tentacles would be made from a metal that reacts to the energetic fields in the environment and it twists/moves based on energy in the air. To be continued...

// I'm figuring it would have to flicker and morph to convey that [octopus symbol]. Would it work as a communication tool...

Hmm, as a "communication tool with self" rather than with others wearing it. That's the point of Octahoop: getting into a creative flow from nothing just interaction with the self (as a living system: the mind and the body) and the natural environment, through observation and play.

So I went further to imagine how could Octahoop help communicate with the self?

First, I imagine wearing Octahoop outside on the move. And so each tentacle would be like a holder of observer's tools: a mini binocular, a tiny microscope, a tube with paper and a pen, a mini torch - all I need to interact with the environment. Here, adding a function to transform this hairhoop into a necklace would be useful: carrying tools for observation under the neck where hands can faster take out a tool out of a tentacle. (Also, if I happen to go to the city for exploration, I'd love to wear it as a necklace too, so that it doesn't bring attention, but still have my creative anchor and observer's toolkit with me).

Lastly, it would be useful to include a wearable tech function here measuring brainwaves and states of relaxation/stress that can then be correlated with creative flow and a pattern of a creative chaos. I'd like to measure steps (to build up on a body intelligence idea) and location too, to see in which places in the forest I captured those ideas landing from the Universe :) So yeah, an app for self use would be a cool addition.

So overall an Octahoop could extend to work like a complete and useful observer's toolkit as well as a symbolic creativity anchor.

I'm really having fun imaging this observer's friend!! LOL :)

[reply]

Ruta

ago @ Shift in Human Values from Input to Output

Like, producerism instead of consumerism?

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ Octahoop

So, like a cat's ears, but octopus tentacles?

// "captures creative energy that lands from the Universe"

I fail to capture how it does it. :)

// builds up a metaphor of an octopus as a symbol of multitudes, a networked thinking (creativity), plurality of identities that creative lifestyle enables.

I'm figuring it would have to flicker and morph to convey that. Would it work as a communication tool that transfers the brainwaves between individuals wearing it?

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ 0 > oo

I have an impression, that Infinity requires the expertise of at least 3 kind of communities:

  1. Foresight.org, BFI.org, metaculus.com for the "Issues/Puzzles" part,
  2. Halfbakery.com for the "Ideas" part,
  3. Pioneer.app, IndieHackers.com for the "Projects" part.

There is more, like the products part, but at this time, taking the cultures of community focusing the first 3 things would be most beneficial, I think.

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ Bio-evolutionary Hypothesis for Absence of Green or Purple Stars

So, we could perhaps make special type of eye-glasses that correct for this cognitive bias.

Such glasses would have to compensate for lack of perception of broad-spectrum green and broad-spectrum purple colors by condensing the off-narrow-band greens and purples into the specific narrow bands that we perceive. This compensation would work a bit like reducing the standard deviations of green and purple distributions.

With such corrective glasses then we would see green stars, and purple stars, if they actually peak at these colors.

[reply]

Inyuki

ago @ library twin project for the post-apocalyptic world

Hey, [Bassxn2], thanks for the idea~ We're already doing it (library for post-apocalyptic world) :) However, there's a number of problems with this idea:

  • Ideas are not questions, but your subtitle asks a question instead of giving answer. If you're asking a question, you should write it under the "Issues" not the "ideas". [not-an-idea], [marked-for-moving-to-issues]
  • It is widely known to exist, the idea of "Foundation" has been floating and discussed for millenia, and the term for it is -- "rosetta"

My impression is, that you just saw what we're doing here, and you probably also saw the Apple TV series "Foundation", and then, realized (identified) what we're doing at 0 > oo (which I've described here, and here, and here, back in 2005 year). The initiatives span back to the term called "Rosetta", back to ancient Egypt. That we use automatic categorization today is not really something new, because it's becoming a default thing to. So, I see a need to make move this topic to issues rather than ideas.

That said, the idea part:

" Idea purposes:

  • collect all digital and non digital precepts knowledge for human life in earth and cosmos
  • digitise the undigitised, undegitise the digitised...
  • Twin creation:
    • use of smart systems thinking and technology to well categorise and create the trees. "

So, you're proposing an application of auto-categorization to civilization knowledge?

Yes for that, I've just added that as a task to auto-categorize content on Infinity.

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ library twin project for the post-apocalyptic world

I assume that those times technology is burned, and only technology we have is the technology we have in our minds and bodies, whether native, acquired, or developed. Whether electronic magnetic atmospheric mechanical sonoric etheric graphic syntactic etc...

[reply]

Bassxn2

ago @ Grounded Stream . com

Hello Mindey, we fixed it, there's a place holder landing page now. Still needs some editing I'll do today.

[reply]

Bassxn2

ago @ Artifcial Blood

What seems practically doable, is experimenting with model organisms, say, trying to use blood of a frog to power a lizard, and see how feasible it is to prevent immune reactions by selectively filtering out certain proteins, like unwanted antibodies.

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ multi-calendural

[BassinI], how this "multi-calendural" work? Could you summarize the method of it in one sentence under the title, which currently reads -- "a calendar is your way of telling people your rythm".

Yes, we are thinking of changing the social rhythms, make them more free-paced, creative, and integrative of stages from asking, to ideating, to doing. Is this idea -- a reflection about what we at Infinity are trying to do as an example of embroidery, or are you proposing some specific new way (new method) to connect multiple calendars?

Or are you suggesting a new type of embroidery? ("The embroidery had his/her calendar tool, for consent purposes...")

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ multi-calendural

Note: I'm aware that the fashion business calendar which is imposed on us by same people who exploit is probably not harmonic, I use here only for an example of long span planning for those who are into that. Also planning ahead of time is a good practice. With supply chain equations and big data we'd be able forecast better with time!

For instant/urgent/quick gigs, is a different flow too.

[reply]

Bassxn2

ago @ Humans as Community

But if we look at the patterns so far, humans are creating this story of continuous defragmenting, until now we reach the individual (we used to be empires until small countries and now individuals borders!!!) . It is the individual that needs to take the decision to appreciate the community, because it is the unit. So much garbage about individualism these days that is the true mis-information and the wor on consciousness. We need individuals just as much we need the community .

When we see that in our design is a part that will only be filled by another or others we see we are all one, and many and the same time. Changing one self is changing collective. We start realising the power of one, and then wake up to power of collective. (Unfortunately tribes will suffer a lot on the future :( I'm purely tribal wiring according to my tropical matrix 3d design but with individual thinking but tribal wiring nonetheless) sidereal and cosmic calculations are also valid, but 3d is activated collectively. So it's the mechanical point of departure.

It's quantum!

Our survival is in the hand of the individual, individuals need to wake up for communities to come together ..

I think... Of course... I don't know ... But I imagin

[reply]

Bassxn2

ago @ Dimensions of Happiness

Cool...

Funn enough I was discussing this today!!

And I said that music is reason why I'm alive today...

Beauty. Is a valid source of happiness. Beauty of formulas, beauty of structures,

The universal concepts of "beauty" "love"

Can they merely be under relationship? Or expression?

Is beauty a relationship, or an experience? Or a meaning?

Is beauty in content/function/process form? Mathematicians seen beauty in numbers!

What is purpose...

Sorry I still can't sleep... Hope I'm not trolling Infiniti ! But CORE thoughts all ovah! This is the time to see what to shed and what to keep for next phase of cycle of hoomans or hoowoomans!

[reply]

Bassxn2

ago @ An economic system that frees humanity from unnecessary suffering and meaningless work

Yeah!

I believe we forget that a human is so so different and unique like everyone else!

We share the same "structure" but different wiring.

I think it's the ultimate test now make such a financial security a reality.

In fact in my belief system we have 5-7 years to build a foundation that will support our future generations and respect our ancestors... Not a long time.

In my imagined system: I understand the following wirings: (inspired and learned about from human design system) 1- tribal wiring 2- individual wiring 3- collective wiring

Also I believe also that there is a set limit of community members before it splits into two which arises conflict if understood.

Because we are here to mutate and blend , and produce all the possibilities? (Perhaps)

So for tribes, they need the food, the marriage, the freedom to be left alone. They should never be in control of the system alone because they are tribal and will always prefer their son/daughter than others. Which people interpret as corruption, and for sure it leads to that with bad understanding and resistance.

Then individuals they come with all the new ideas, they like to live alone, they need space etc .. their freedom is the freedom of all.

And collective which are fit for making sure all is happy, they sometimes steal the ideas of the individual and quarrel a lot with the tribes, but they put the benefit of everyone as a theme.

Why is related? Because money is a currency or an energy×exchanged , and for us all to exchange healthily we must respect our designs .. take care of communities, always accept mutations, and have procedures and processes .. that are organic... Nature gives us all the clues.

Sorry to talk a lot I couldn't sleep..

So I'm thinking of a global coop. Need to sketch it, and I will share hopefully sooner than later.

[reply]

Bassxn2

ago @ Stripe

Ok, thank you. Yes ... You mean in this context it becomes like Kleenex for tissue paper?

I don't like the attitude of any payment gateways so far and the development team are worried about it. If I don't make it happen it will be a cash on delivery system. Which I don't personally mind .

I wish we can create our own financial institution that provides a payment gateway which supports a security plan for the future including health and education...

I'll remember to put it in the idea tracks...

[reply]

Bassxn2

ago @ Grounded Stream . com

I tried to visit the groundedstrem.com - the site you linked as the project's site, but could not reach it. :) It seem to exist in DNS, but not linked to a server yet. I'm curious about what you're building.

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ Stripe

[Bassxn2], it's in fact project that's supposed to be for Stripe. The world knows that Stripe has something that we call equipment -- which is any tool run by a project. Thing is, in order to register operations done by equipment, we have to have not our (other people's) project just to technically add operations done by that equipment. Similarly, you'll find projects like "Ethereum", and so on here. It doesn't mean that these projects are run via Infinity, but the intention is that we can create a structure that creates ontological sense about them: world is run by projects creating tools that perform operations -- a money transfer is just as much of an operation, like a print by a printer, or a cut by a laser, etc.

Today, public is aware of 2 instances of Stripe equipment -- that is the main and test system, in a similar way how a hospital may have a few MRI machines. I'm sure the folks from Stripe would have more to say about the design and web architecture of their service.

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ what is log4j

Thank you! And thanks for elaboration and explanation, appreciated. Noted.

[reply]

Bassxn2

ago @ what is log4j

Welcome to Infinity, [Bassxn2]! :) The log4j is a computer security issue, and 0-day-ish issue, and it's super-widespread, because Log4j is very popular library used in all kind of software.

It's good it's easy to fix:

  • Java 8's Log4j to >=2.17.0
  • Java 7's Log4j to >=2.12.3
  • Java 6's Log4j to >=2.3.1
  • OR remove zip -q -d log4j-core-*.jar org/apache/logging/log4j/core/lookup/JndiLookup.class

Lookup for traces of intrusion:

Take a note, that this issue is very circumstantial time-sensitive, it is not a long-term global challenge. [marked-for-expiry]

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ Stripe

Stripe the stripe stripe? Or a new Stripe? I'm interested!

[reply]

Bassxn2

ago @ 0oo External links

What about singularityhub.com? It was a special/unique community back in the day, though, now it seems to have been merged into su.org.

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ Electrochemical Screen

Yes, and now I remember, I already published this idea before: Material Emulation Screen, -- original, better.

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ Electrochemical Screen

Would this screen be able to feel smooth to touch and shiny like gold one millisecond, yet sticky and black like tar another millisecond?

[reply]

Inyuki

ago @ Civilization Engineering IQ Score

And what would be the "IQ" of a civilization that can do material chemical properties without using atomic nuclei (e.g., being able to do Electrochemical screen-like or Positronic Material Emulation Screen-like thing) to manipulate electromagnetic field? Civilization CE-0?

[reply]

Inyuki

ago @ Programmatic Access and Control

I'm thinking, it would be worth inviting all the people mentioned here, and others who are interested to a web conference on this topic. Data and systems access and control is a generic need.

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ Discovery Methods for Living Systems

// What new methods would help explore consciousness of other beings?

Mathematics, as the study of all possible structures, can help.

// "a river is not seen as alive"

The consciousness is not a binary -- it's a continuum -- so, even a river can be seen as having consciousness, even the atoms and molecules, and so on -- the entire world is a physical field, that is connected, intricate and particular. I like how Paul Budnik describes it in his video poem:

"I assume, that consciousness in some form is the essence of physical structure. Of course, only physical entities that have the capacities of sensation, memory and communication can describe their conscious experience, but other animate or even inanimate matter may still have some form of immediate experience, albeit much simpler than what we experience:

  • when does the fading consciousness of someone dying of alzheimer's end completely?

  • when does the consciousness begin in the developing human embry or fetus?

The simplest assumption is that it never begins or ends, but is only transformed as the structure of the brain and nervous system is transformed."

And so, he concludes, that:

"If consciousness is the essence of physical structure, then mathematics, which is the study of all possible structures, may be a source of insight into what we are facing and how we might deal with it [...]" (see the book in the link)

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ 0 > oo

Agree how important is to be "in motion" for the oo as a system.

Hmm, I'm not sure about "ideas in motion", because how often people work on somebody else's ideas? People need incentives to do that. More often people work on their own ideas, or just projects, where ideas unfold later in the experimentation process.

To me, an interesting measure of value of the oo system would be: Link-Building, i.e. how active the network is? How often members comment and collaborate on each other's posts? The more diverse links between members posts, the more diverse creative thoughts sparked, the more quality content on the system, the more retention to the system, the more engagement, the more referrals.

Overall, I see the health of the oo system being - links and relationships between each others that spark creative thoughts for everyone.

Btw - improved replies to specific comments are useful!

[reply]

Ruta

ago @ 0 > oo

Thinking of the major KPI for our system, I think, is the "ideas" and "ideas in motion", where "in motion" - means, that they are actively being worked (e.g., has periodic updates).

Btw., you can reply to comments and ledger events directly, so it is possible to form specific threads and respond to works, etc.

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ 0 > oo

Note: Contacts of innovator communities:

  • [Japan] https://dynalist.io/d/iIT_nuAiAMx9JxctYclliF43

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ 0 > oo

Alright. I've added paths: /invitation and /hi to serve as place for public invites (so, for example, clicking on 0oo.li/hi or 0oo.li/invitation leads to the public invite.)

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ 0 > oo

The text inside the invite links does not disappear after the invite is used, so they remain accessible, and any old invite link is still readable, or do you mean we need a nicer URL for it, like 0oo.li/public-letter or something?

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ 0 > oo

Thanks! Oh and I meant - can invite page text be accessed easier on the website and shared with people?

[reply]

Ruta

ago @ 0 > oo

The oldest one is here, however, there's the (paper) (on the equation model), which supersedes that design.

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ 0 > oo

Where is the Whitepaper of 0oo? I'd like to share it with a friend (but without an invite, just text to read). It would be useful to see Whitepaper linked in the footer of the website and in the 0oo project description :)

[reply]

Ruta

ago @ 0 > oo

I got it. This may be useful. What about using "Hide from Public" checkbox in the results to use as drafts? Selecting this allows to hide it from everyone who are not in the "members" of the project (but it will still get a notification in project channel). I'll consider adding this feature in next iteration.

The way I'm doing it, is that I list the items that I have completed by editing a target, just adding bullet points in it, and then, writing an update as a result with more details.

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ Dog Glider

Just fun to imagine.

I guess some breeds of dogs are small and fast enough to lift off all on their own, but wings would likely impede the acceleration, so, we could make wings that expand when certain windspeed is registered, and released back to normal when lifting weight becomes negative.

So, I'm imaging a dog that expands the wings automatically, when reached appropriate speed (could be done easily with air-loaded pistons, which would release the air to retract, small battery and a pump could restitute the pressure)

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ 0 > oo

feedback request:

I'd like to be able to add "drafts" to "results". because I love lifelogging my tasks in my project pages when they happen. with drafts, I could improve my result declarations - I could find time to record a report on each result later, and turn a draft into a public result declaration later.

[reply]

Ruta

ago @ SYMBÉS

Hey hey, so our workshop test happened! And here is feedback from workshop test with 7 people (4 pairs):

  • “I’d like to stay in the first 3 exercises [of Bacterias in Chaos] longer, like for 30mins! they were fun! nice way to bond, breaking barriers, before the big things, laughing at another person you dont know, then deep things! and then flying! a sensation of creating something, like music, together. from the surface to deep-ness!”

  • “beautiful journey” x2

  • “video were so useful, without it, it would be hard to understand exercises”

  • MIRO: “for people new to Miro, Miro is hard”

  • INSTRUCTIONS: “without facilitator explaining the first exercise [Greetings + Butterfly Effects], it’s hard to understand what to do!”

BUTTERFLY EFFECT Activity:

  • “for the first exercise, [Butterfly Effects] 3mins is way not enough time!”

  • “we did not understand what to do in the first two circles.. that we needed to click on those sticky notes and add our interests there..”

  • “we did not understand if we need to make a butterfly from the first two circles or what?”, “we did not understand that two circles are butterfly wings… “, “what’s that green sticky in the middle?”

CHAOS Activity:

  • 1 pair: “we did it, just by reading instructions. 25mins was enough time”

  • 2 pair: “plenty of time, we even had time left to chat”, “interesting, pretty well, but we wondered what was the point?”

  • 3 pair: “not enough time to do the last 1min activity, cause we dived deep into Chaos main activity for long time!” [Ruta: lets add 3mins extra?], “leave this big activity for the end, because people can go deep into this one”, “waving hands.. playful! we would start creating something crazy soon! would be cool to see activity expanded..”, “really like it, reminded me a retreat experience, just there after “so what” they say “thank you””

Suggestions:

  • rethink Miro icebreaker

  • add more time to Butterfly Effects activity (from 3 to 7mins?) and create a video instructions, better text instructions and hand-drawn shapes

  • add 3mins extra for Chaos exercise

  • definitely facilitator should explain the exercises before opening Breakouts

  • make videos faster

  • co-creation exercise after Chaos!

  • add a contact form for matching participants after?

UPDATE: we got more feedback, so here's one document with all feedback and screenshots of how our experience looked like during a test!

[reply]

Ruta

ago @ SYMBÉS

I'm very curious what has been recorded in the zoom call. Any chance you will edit it and publish the most interesting element of it?

[reply]

Inyuki

ago @ SYMBÉS

:) The linked result only contains the image of uploading it to YouTube, registering a result without the content kinda pointless, It would be much more fun to get to know more, something like a report on it.

[reply]

Mindey

ago @ SYMBÉS

What to bring to test workshop session this Saturday 5pm UTC:

  • join on computer,

  • a public Miro board will be shared for use during the session,

  • bring in a glass of water,

  • everyone will be asked to turn on the camera for the duration of the workshop (but don't worry, we'll have a fun hack of Zoom system to make sure everyone is comforable to be on video :) )

see you Saturday 5pm UTC!

[reply]

Ruta

ago @ SYMBÉS

[Mindey] I'm so happy you'd join us for this test workshop! Saturday seem to work better for friends on pacific time zone. I know you're now on Japanese time zone. I'm wondering how to juggle all the time zones on the planet Earth :) there will be 4-6 people attending - important to know availability before the workshop, because we're testing how people will experience our workshop in pairs, so if 4 friends join the test, 2 pairs will be formed to experience the workshop, and if 2 friends join the test, only one pair will be formed. if 3 people join, still 1 pair will be formed.

overall, I suggest Saturday 5pm UTC, I hope you're awake by then [Mindey]!

and everyone else is welcome to join, just comment here or message me on Telegram :)

A calendar link is right here

[reply]

Ruta


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